（翻译）评测：Zeiss 的 8x50 望远镜

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原文来自http://www.holgermerlitz.de/zeiss8x50.html

Review: 8x50 Zeiss (Oberkochen) vs. Zeiss (Jena) Nobilem Super vs. Docter Nobilem B/GA

by Holger Merlitz   翻译 北旅论坛footway

In a previous review, 7x50 binoculars for use under low light conditions were tested. The request for exit pupils as large as 7.1mm leads to either small fields of view or, if an apparent field of 60 degs. or more is wanted, to a sophisticated design with either huge prisms or semi-apochromatic objectives. Many people, however, are never able to make use of such a wide exit pupil because their pupils won't dilate to this size even in total darkness. A binocular of specification 8x50 provides exit pupils of 6.25 mm, still enough for night use, but easier to construct with proper apparent field of views. For example, a manufacturer may produce a 7x50, 8x50 and 10x50, all three of them with identical bodies and same true fields of view, e.g. 7 degs., but different oculars, which then necessarily lead to apparent fields of 70 degs (10x50), 56 degs. (8x50) and only 49 degs. (7x50).
在先前评测中，已测试7x50规格望远镜在低照明下的使用。大到7.1mm的出瞳直径的需求，导致要么是小视野；要么是：如果表现视场想达到60度或更大，老练的设计是需要巨大的棱镜或半消色差物镜。然而许多人永远不能用到这么大的出瞳直径，因为即使在完全漆黑时他们的瞳孔也不能扩张到这么大。一个8x50规格的望远镜能提供6.25mm的出瞳直径，仍然足够夜间使用，能提供恰当的表现视场，更容易制造。举例来说，一个厂家能提供7x50、8x50和10x50规格望远镜，这三款都有同样的镜体和同样7度的角视场，但目镜不同，必然导致表现视场分别是70度（10x50），56度（8x50）和仅仅49度（7x50）。
The 8x50 therefore appears to provide a good compromise between low light ability and apparent field of view. In this review, three classical high-end binoculars of this type are compared. Unfortunately, none of them is produced any more, but at least the Docter Nobilem (the former Zeiss Jena Octarem) is still available on the surplus markets, sometimes in brand new condition. Whoever is searching for a current line high end 8x50 will probably fail to find a decently priced Porro glass, but end up with a roof-prism design such as Leica's Ultravid or Swarovski's SLC and will have to pay a premium.
因此8x50规格显得提供了低照明下能力和表现视场之间的好折衷。在本评测中，三个此规格的高端经典望远镜将互相比较。不幸的是:他们都停产了，但至少Docter Nobilem (从前的 Zeiss Jena Octarem)仍能在剩余物资市场得到，有时是全新品相。谁若在搜寻当前生产的高端8x50，将无法找到合适价格的保罗镜，只能找到屋脊镜如Leica's Ultravid或者Swarovski's SLC，并且要付出更多费用。

Fig.1: The Zeiss (Oberkochen) 8x50
Towards the end of WWII, Zeiss (Jena) was taken over by the Soviets, whereas a second branch was set up in the Western Zone of occupation to become the "Zeiss-Opton Optische Werkstaette Oberkochen GmbH". The work on binoculars resumed immediately thereafter, so that in 1954 the first new Porro type model, the Zeiss 8x30, was introduced. As can be verified on this list, the first of the 50 mm models, the 7x50, appeared in 1956, followed by the 8x50 and 10x50 in 1957 (the 7x50 B/GA is, with few modifications and with individually focused oculars, still in production). These binoculars employ the idea of air-spaced tele-objectives, where the distance between objective and ocular is smaller than the focal length, leading to the characteristic compact body shape. From 1960 onwards the 8x50 was called 8x50B, with 'B' indicating it to be suitable for eye-glass wearer, but to my knowledge it were only the eye-cups which were then made of rubber to fold down - the ocular construction, with 5 lens-elements (a 2-1-2 design of type Zeiss Astroplanar), remained unchanged. These 50mm Porro binoculars did certainly represent the best glasses made for the civilian market at that time, and nowadays collectors are willing to pay 500 Euro or more for such an item in good condition.
二战后，Zeiss (Jena)被苏联接管，但另一个分支在西方占据期间成立了"Zeiss-Opton Optische Werkstaette Oberkochen GmbH"。自此有关望远镜的研制工作立刻重新开始，于是在1954年第一款新保罗镜子Zeiss 8x30诞生了。在这个单子上可看到，第一款50mm镜子，7x50诞生于1956，后面跟着8x50和10x50诞生于1957年（7x50 B/GA，只有很小的改动，目镜独立调焦类型现在仍在生产）。这些镜子都使用了长焦的分离物镜，如此物镜与目镜的距离可以小于焦距，可得到标志性的紧凑外形。1960年前的8x50叫做8x50B，‘B’表示适合戴眼镜使用，但据我所知这镜子的眼罩是能折向下的橡胶做的，5片玻璃的目镜结构（Zeiss Astroplanar设计的2-1-2）是保持不变的。这些50mm的保罗镜的确是当时民用市场最好的，现在的收藏家愿意为好品相的一个镜子付出500欧元或者更多。

Fig. 2: The Zeiss Jena 8x50 Nobilem Super.
Zeiss Jena began with the development of the 8x50 Nobilem Super (and its brother, the 12x50 Nobilem Spezial) in 1978. It was obviously an attempt to copy the Zeiss Oberkochen models (compare with the early prototype which was even closer to the West-design), but with increased performance parameters like field of view. It was then introduced in 1980 and under production until about 1985. Although being brilliant binoculars, they came up too late: During the 80s, bulky Porro binoculars had gone out of fashion and the era of more compact and elegant roof prisms had begun. The construction of the Nobilem Super, with air spaced teleobjectives and a 5 lens-element ocular (very similar to the Zeiss Oberkochen design) was highly sophisticated and costly even under East German production conditions, and they did never sell as well as expected (and deserved!), despite of the fact that they were second to none in their optical performance. In 1985 they were replaced with the simpler models Octarem and Dodecarem, which, a couple of years later, were again re-named 'Nobilem'. Today, collectors pay 600 Euro or more for these binoculars, and they are difficult to find on the surplus markets.
Zeiss Jena1978年开始研制8x50 Nobilem Super (还有它的兄弟12x50 Nobilem Spezial) 。明显试图仿制Zeiss Oberkochen的产品（相比之下，它的早期原型更接近西方设计），但提高了一些性能参数如视野大小。1980年开始生产一直到1985年。虽然是超群的望远镜，但它出现的太晚了：80年代，大体积的保罗镜已经过时了，更加紧凑雅致的屋脊镜时**始了。Nobilem Super的结构，长焦分离物镜，5片式目镜（和Zeiss Oberkochen的设计非常像），即使是在东德的生产条件下，也制作精良，价格昂贵，从来没有预期那样卖的好（应该卖的很好），尽管事实上，在光学性能上没有能超过它的。在1985年它们被更简单的Octarem 和 Dodecarem取代，几年后，Octarem 和 Dodecarem被再次更名为'Nobilem'。如今，收藏家要为这镜子付出600欧元或更多，并且在剩余物资市场上很难寻觅到。

Fig. 3: The Docter Nobilem 8x50 B/GA (formerly Zeiss Jena Octarem)
When Zeiss Jena in 1985 introduced a new high-end line of Porro Prism binoculars, which originally included the 8x50 Octarem and the 12x50 Dodecarem, they did something very smart: They returned back to the classical design with a long body shape, allowing for longer focal lengths and therefore relaxing the technical requirements inherent in the Nobilem Super without the need to sacrifice optical performance. With somewhat smaller field of view, the ocular construction could be simplified, while, at the same time, the eye-relief could be increased. Additionally, mechanical features were improved: The Octarem and Dodecarem were splash-water proof. The following link contains the scan of an original article printed in the Jenaer Rundschau in 1985 (German language), describing the construction of the Octarem and Dodecarem. These binoculars, shortly after re-named 'Nobilem', were cheap compared to the Nobilem Super, therefore selling better, and later supplemented with 10x50, 7x50, 8x56 and 15x60 models. Some of them are still under production by Docter Optic. In good condition, the 8x50 Octarem/Nobilem today sells for 350 Euro on the second-hand market.
1985年Zeiss Jena生产了一款新的高端保罗望远镜，最初包括8x50 Octarem和12x50 Dodecarem，它们在下面事上做的很聪明：返回到了长身躯的传统设计，允许更长的焦距，于是放宽了Nobilem Super固有的技术要求，也不需要牺牲光学性能。视野要求相对较小，所以目镜结构可以更简单，同时出瞳距离可以增加一些。此外，机械性能得以改良：Octarem 和 Dodecarem是防水的。下面的链接包含了Jenaer Rundschau于1985年所写的原始论文的扫描（德语），描述了Octarem 和 Dodecarem的结构。这些不久以后更名为'Nobilem'的望远镜，比Nobilem Super便宜，所以卖的更好，后来增加了10x50、7x20、8x56和15x60规格。某些规格在Docter Optic仍然生产。现如今好品相的8x50 Octarem/Nobilem在二手市场能卖到350欧元。

Fig. 4: The Zeiss (Oberkochen), Nobilem Super and Nobilem/Octarem

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The following table summarizes some of the specifications of the contenders.
下表中是被评测对象的各项指标

Optical performance 光学性能
Angle of view: It was the main goal of Zeiss Jena to create a copy of the popular West-design, but with a wider field. The Nobilem Super was successful in that matter. Its rather bulky prisms were a good investment, leading to 5 additional degs. apparent field of view which produce a pleasant wide angle feeling. The 59 degs. of the Zeiss (Oberkochen) and the Docter are just at the edge - wide enough to avoid the tunnel view, but not sufficient to deserve the label 'wide angle'. At least, they still offer much more field than whatever is coming along with most of the 7x50 binoculars I have seen.
视角：Zeiss Jena的主要目标是创造一个西方流行设计但拥有更广的视野的副本。在这方面Nobilem Super是成功的。它的相当巨大的棱镜是一个好投资，导致了另外5度表现视场，提供了令人舒适的广角。Zeiss (Oberkochen) 和 Docter的59度只是处于足以避免管窥视野感觉的边缘上，但不足以标签以“广角”。但至少，它们仍然比我见过的大部分7x50镜子提供了更广的视野。
Image sharpness: This is a strong side of all three contenders. Especially the Docter and the Zeiss (Oberkochen) offer images which are sharp until close to the edge of field. The star test exhibits the first significant distortions at about 80% (radial) off the center, and even at the edge they remain on a low level. The Nobilem Super, with its wider field, is slightly weaker at the edge, with low-to-moderate distortions, starting from about 70% off-center. This is still an excellent result. During day time observations, the edge distortions remain insignificant in all three binoculars, indicating the high level of optical know how put into these instruments.
图像清晰度：这三款镜子在这方面都是强项。特别是Docter 和 Zeiss (Oberkochen)一直到接近视场边缘都提供了清楚图像。观星测试显示在半径80%处开始察觉变形，但即使在边缘也保持在低水平上。拥有更大视野的Nobilem Super，在边缘处稍微差些，从70%半径开始有从低到中等程度的畸变。这仍然是优秀的结果。在白天的观测中，三款镜子的边缘失真保持在无关紧要的程度，显示了这些镜子的光学方面的高水平。
Image color: None of these binoculars is totally free of color, but they produce a slight yellowish ('warm') tint of same intensity in these three models. It is not reaching any disturbing level, but becomes visible once a blue sky is observed and its color saturation is compared to the one produced with another binocular of fully neutral color rendition (like the Fujinon 7x50).
图像颜色：这三个镜子中没有哪个是完全真色，都显示了相同程度的轻微偏黄（偏暖色）。都没有到达任何令人烦恼的程度，但在看蓝天时能更明显，其颜色饱和度就像另一个完全无色的镜子（像Fujinon 7x50）在某一方面加深了。
Rectilinear distortion: All three binoculars show a slight pincushion distortion. This helps to eliminate the globe effect and produce a smooth image motion when the binocular is panning during terrestrial observations. I found the panning behavior of the Nobilem Super particularly nice, reminding me on the superb characteristics of the 7x40 (Checkpoint-Charlie) binocular of the NVA, but its contenders are not far behind.
直线畸变：所有三款镜子表现了轻微的枕形畸变。这能消除掉球面效应和在地平线移动观测时得到平滑视场。我发现Nobilem Super的视场表现特别的好，让我想起了NVA的7x40 (Checkpoint-Charlie)的极好特性，但它的竞争者并没有被甩很远。
Stray light: Light from sources outside the field of view can enter the instrument through large angles and illuminate the internal tube walls, are in parts scattered back into the optical path and produce a diffuse illumination of the image. In many cases, this stray light is visible as a diffuse ring close to the edge of the field. This effect can be observed in the Docter Nobilem, and, to a much lesser extent, in the Zeiss (Oberkochen) and the Nobilem Super. The high level of stray light suppression is again a property the Nobilem Super shares with the 7x40 DF. I suspect that the short body shape of this glass (as well as the Oberkochen's) supports the prevention of this type of diffuse stray light. In contrast, the long tubes of the Docter provide a lot of inner-wall area to be illuminated, and despite of the existing baffles, some residual stray light is able to enter the light path. In my opinion, this is the only significant weakness of the Docter Nobilem 8x50.
漫射光：视野外的光源射出的光线能以大角度进入镜筒照射到镜筒内壁，部分散射光进入到主光路中对图像产生了漫射照明。在很多情况下，在视场边缘可见杂散光的环状漫射。Docter Nobilem可见到这效果，Zeiss (Oberkochen) 和 Nobilem Super有更小程度的现象。高水平的漫射光抑制能力再一次成为和7x40 DF同一派的Nobilem Super的特性。我猜测Oberkochen的短小的身体能有效抑制漫射光。相反，Docter的长身躯提供了许多可被照亮内壁区域，虽然有遮挡物，有些剩余漫射光能进入主光路。依我看来，这是Docter Nobilem 8x50唯一的重大弱点。
Ghost images: If, at night, a bright object (street lantern, moon) is positioned into the field, reflections on the air-to-glass surfaces take place, which can lead to multiple 'ghost' images of the light source. The suppression of this type of reflections can serve as an indicator for the quality of anti-reflection coating. In fact, the Zeiss (Oberkochen), being the oldest binocular and the only one with singly coated lenses, has some trouble, especially if the light source is very bright. The produced ghost images are highly diffusive - perhaps produced at the air space between the objective lens-elements - and thereby reducing the image contrast. This effect is visible when observing the moon, so that the surrounding sky does not come out as black as it should. The Docter Nobilem produces a single, well localized ghost image of low-to-moderate intensity and red color, which is not affecting the overall contrast of the image. Surprisingly, the Nobilem Super performs even better. Ghost images show up only at high intensity and remain on a lower level than the Docter's. I do not believe that the coating of the Docter Nobilem is in any aspect inferior to the Nobilem's (Super), but the particular ocular construction of the Docter may promote the creation of the single ghost image as described above.
鬼影：晚上，一个明亮物体（路灯，月亮）进入视野，在玻璃表面发生反射，能产生光源的多个鬼魂般的影像。对于这反射的抑制能力可作为镀膜质量的一个指标。事实上，Zeiss (Oberkochen)，作为只有单层镀膜的最老的镜子，尤其当光源非常强时，会遇到些麻烦。产生的鬼影（可能产生于分离的物镜之间）扩散很厉害，减少了目标图像对比度。当看月亮时能察觉到此现象，导致周围的天空也不是应该的黑色了。Docter Nobilem产生仅1个固定位置的鬼影，有低到中等程度，红色，不影响图像的整体对比度。出人意料的是，Nobilem Super表现的甚至更好，只有强光源才产生鬼影并且比Docter的更弱。我不相信Docter Nobilem的镀膜在任何方面劣于Nobilem Super，但Docter的特殊目镜构造可能容易产生如上所说的单一鬼影。
Low light performance: These are binoculars with large exit pupils and therefore specialists for low light applications. It is interesting to find the Docter Nobilem clearly performing best in this discipline. Even under daylight, its image appears to be slightly brighter than the Nobilem's (Super), and visibly brighter than the Zeiss (Oberkochen). Under very low light the Docter is able to resolve details which are not as clearly discernible in the Nobilem Super. The light transmission of a binocular depends to a large extent on the quality of coating, but also on the number of optical elements to be passed, and here the Docter is certainly in a better position. Its objectives are not air spaced, the ocular construction is simpler, with less number of lens-elements, and the prisms are cemented to avoid another air-to-glass transit. This may be the reason for the excellent low light performance of the Docter, which comes very close to the 7x50 Fujinon FMT-SX. The Zeiss (Oberkochen) is not fully competitive here. The combination of a sophisticated design (and therefore many lens-elements) and its simple coating lead to a visible reduction of light transmission.
低照明表现：这些镜子都有大出瞳直径所以在低照明表现上都很专业。有趣的是发现Docter Nobilem在本评测中明显表现最好。即使在白天，它的图像也表现的比Nobilem Super的稍微亮一些，比Zeiss (Oberkochen)的明显更亮一些。在非常暗的环境中，Nobilem Super 不能清晰分辨的情况下，Docter依然能表现细节。望远镜的光线穿透率很大程度上取决于镀膜质量，但也取决于所穿过的玻璃片数，这里Docter明显占据了优势，它的物镜是不分离的，目镜结构简单，有更少的透镜片数，胶合的棱镜减少了一个空气玻璃界面。这或许是Docter在低照明下表现优秀的原因，性能非常接近7x50 Fujinon FMT-SX。Zeiss (Oberkochen)完全不具备竞争力，复杂的结构（有许多镜片）和简单的镀膜导致透光率的明显降低。

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Mechanical construction 机械结构
Being high-end binoculars, these instruments are obviously equipped with precise mechanical movements and a shock resistant collimation. The most rugged of the contenders is clearly the Docter Nobilem, which is splash-water proof and comes with a rubber armor. This binocular can be used under severe environmental conditions. Another plus is its eye-relief, with 19mm sufficient to be comfortably used with spectacles on, although, with 17mm, the Nobilem (Super) should as well cause no serious obstacles. The Zeiss (Oberkochen) came with two types of eye-cups: One standard set for use without glasses, and another, shorter and rubberized one for use with glasses (the photos show the Zeiss with the short eye-cups). It seems that even the short versions were wasting too much of eye-relief to really exploit the 16mm, and it was therefore not fully usable with glasses on. Later versions of the Zeiss were then equipped with the usual fold-down rubber eye-cups (Zeiss 8x50 B). I prefer the position of the central focuser as realized in the Docter, which can be operated most conveniently while holding the glass tightly in both hands. The Zeiss (Oberkochen) version is doing fine, too, whereas my hands are a little too small to comfortably focus the Nobilem Super without a bit of moving up. The Zeiss (Oberkochen) is noticeably less heavy compared to the Nobilem Super, although, at only 8x magnification, even 1.25-1.30 kg of the Nobilems are still tolerable.
作为高端望远镜，这三个镜子明显表现了精密的机械运动和光轴抗震性。这其中最坚固的显然是Docter Nobilem，能防水溅和有外包胶，这镜子能用在极端苛刻的环境下。另外优势是它的19mm的出瞳距离足够让戴眼镜的人舒服使用，尽管Nobilem (Super)的17mm应该也不会引起严重障碍。Zeiss (Oberkochen)有两种类型的眼罩：标准型的是给不戴眼镜的人使用的；另外一种，更短的橡胶制的给戴眼镜使用的（照片上的是短眼罩的）。似乎即使是短眼罩版本也浪费了16mm出瞳距离的太多部分，以至于不能完全符合戴眼镜使用。后来的版本使用了通常的折叠橡胶眼罩(Zeiss 8x50 B)。我喜欢Docter的中心调焦的位置，当被双手紧紧握住时，能被极其方便的操作。我的手对Nobilem Super显得有些过小以至于若不稍微移动就不能充裕的调焦，而Zeiss (Oberkochen)就表现的很好。Zeiss (Oberkochen)相比Nobilem Super显著的轻，尽管只有8倍的放大率，甚至Nobilems的1.25-1.30公斤也是能忍受的。
Summary总结
The following table is supposed to summarize the above observations. The best performing binocular gets three points, the following contenders two and one, respectively. In case several binoculars are ranking equally, their scores are averaged.
下表是上述各性能的总结。表现最好的镜子得3分，后面的分别得2和1。如果几个镜子的排名同样，它们的分数取平均。

The 'final score' is the sum of the individual scores and is intended to serve as an orientation only.
Final score是各项得分的和，仅供参考。
It is fair to announce two winners of this competition. Although both Nobilems differ among each other in many details, it appears impossible to judge which of them is the better one. The Nobilem Super has got the wider field, a better stray light suppression and has got the edge in ghost image suppression, whereas the Nobilem/Octarem has got a better edge-sharpness, a brighter image and is better sealed against the weather. The Nobilem Super is perhaps the more spectacular binocular: Zeiss (Jena) has pushed its construction to the technical limits to gain a few extra degs. field of view and still keep the body short and compact. The later Nobilem/Octarem design was much more conventional, less compact, but cheaper, at the same time fault tolerant and altogether hardly behind the 'Super' in its optical abilities. When it comes to performance/price, the Nobilem/Octarem is surely the better choice. This is all the more true for today's surplus markets, where collectors have driven the price of the Nobilem Super into astronomical dimensions. In fact it is quite difficult to find this instrument at all, and there are binocular fans who did never hold the Nobilem Super in their hands.
Whoever feels sorry about that should be reminded on the recently introduced Miyauchi 7x50 Binon, which as well combines the features of large exit pupils with a wide angle. In a straight comparison, the edge sharpness of the Nobilem Super is better than the Miyauchi's, and they are an even match in stray light suppression, but in all other disciplines the Miyauchi is at least a little bit ahead of the Zeiss Jena glass. I think the Miyauchi could be regarded as a suitable replacement for the Nobilem Super.
本测试选出两名优胜者是公平的。尽管两款Nobilems在许多细节上不同，似乎无法判断哪个更好。Nobilem Super有更宽阔的视野，更好的杂散光抑制能力，抑制鬼影而得到图像轮廓；而Nobilem/Octarem有更好的边缘像质，图像更亮，对外密封性更好。Nobilem Super或许是更轰动的望远镜：Zeiss (Jena)推动结构上的技术限制以期得到更宽视野并且保持镜体的短小和紧凑。后来的Nobilem/Octarem设计就相对非常传统，没那么紧凑，但更便宜了，同时能抗粗鲁使用并且在光学能力方面总体上几乎不差于'Super'。若谈到性价比，Nobilem/Octarem肯定是更好的选择。当前剩余货物市场更真实的情况是，收藏家将obilem Super的价格推到了天文数字般，事实上要找到这个镜子非常困难，有些望远镜爱好者从来没有体验过Nobilem Super。
任何为此感到遗憾的人可以注意一下最近推出的Miyauchi 7x50 Binon，它结合了大出瞳直径和宽视野的特性。在直接比较下，Nobilem Super边缘像质好于Miyauchi的，在杂散光抑制方面旗鼓相当，但在其它方面Miyauchi起码要稍微超过Zeiss Jena镜子。我认为Miyauchi可当做Nobilem Super合适的替代品。
The Zeiss (Oberkochen) 8x50 is actually not far behind its younger competitors. If equipped with a state of the art coating, this design could still compete with any other high end binocular available these days. The Zeiss also proves that Porro type binoculars do not necessarily need to be heavy and bulky. The Leica 8x50 Ultravid weights 1.0 kg, the Trinovid and the Swarovski SLC are with 1.15 kg even heavier than the Zeiss. To be fair, one should mention that these roof-type binoculars are waterproof, but not every user urgently needs such a feature. I hope that once upon a time a manufacturer decides to pick up this design and produces a modern 8x50 Porro prism binocular, with a reasonable price tag (which could be around 700 Euro), and on a quality level of this old Zeiss.
Zeiss (Oberkochen) 8x50事实上并不是很远的落后于年轻竞争者。如果有高质量的镀膜，这镜子依然能和当前生产的高端镜子一争高低。Zeiss证明了保罗镜不需要那么庞大沉重，Leica 8x50 Ultravid重1.0kg，Trinovid 和 Swarovski SLC重1.15kg，都超过了Zeiss。为了公平，有人会强调这些屋脊镜是防水的，但不是每个使用者都迫切需要这个性能。我期望先前某厂家决定再启用这个设计生产现代化的8x50保罗镜，有一个合理价格（应该大约700欧元），并且质量水平和这个老Zeiss镜一样。
Disclaimer 免责声明
The information given in this report reflects the personal impression and opinion of the author only. I cannot guarantee for the accuracy of any given specification. I have neither been payed nor have I been supported in any other way to write this review.
在本报告中的资料反映了个人的印象和作者的见解而已。我不能保证任何特定规格的准确性。写这个报告我没有得到任何付费和任何支持。
Links
Docter Optics (USA agent), producing the Nobilem line
Zeiss (Oberkochen) 8x50 on Fan Tao's page
Docter 8x50 Nobilem/Octarem on Fan Tao's page
Zeiss (Jena) 8x50 Nobilem Super on Fan Tao's page
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Last updated: Jan 2005
最后更新：2005.1

85983

可以跟帖了 哦叶

棱丝

回复3楼:
好样的, 精神可嘉.

qxzd

英文了得！

我爱baby

非常棒的翻译！ 感谢LZ

看过一只东蔡NOTAREM8x32屋脊，就生产年代而言光学水准是不错的。偏些黄但锐利度上佳，俄罗斯FOTON系列似乎是它的仿制品。
东蔡后期民用望远镜坛子里少见，评测文章也几乎没有，这是份很好的参考资料。

施华老高

哦。。。非常专业的翻译。。。

zgy5718

谢楼主，学习了

footway

谢谢指正，已修改。

19501025

好文好文.........